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peterB

Question for the consistent profiters

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Hello,

i just wonder if it is possible to tell how many trades did it take for you to become consistently profitable traders? Or at least untill you could say that you are making money by trading.

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It took me over a year to become a consistently profitable trader.  I was one of the dumb ones, and decided that I didn't need to use a Simulator account and that I could just learn on the fly.  Well, over $30,000.00 in losses later, I changed my mind.  I hit the books, watched videos, and traded in SIM for 3 months before I started trading live again.  And, when I did trade live, I started with 100 shares (or less) per trade, and only increased my share size by 25 percent each week if I had a profitable week.  It took me about 4 months to reach my current position sizing.  

When you're first getting started, DONT focus on the money.  Focus on quality setups, respecting your rules, and most importantly, MANAGING YOUR RISK.  90 percent of day traders fail.  If you want to be a part of the ten percent who make it, do it the right way.  

1)  Educate yourself and determine your strategies
2) Practice and refine your strategies in SIM for a minimum of 3 months
3)  When going live, start with SMALL position sizing and DONT focus on making money
4) Slowly and practically/sensibly increase your position size.  Don't go from 100 share to 500.  Honestly, don't even go from 100 to 200.  Increase your share size incrementally.
5) Continue to educate yourself.  If you break your rules, see steps 3 and 4.  You can always go back to smaller share size while you improve your processes.  
6) Congratulations, you're now part of the 10 percent. 

Edited by KurtLoeblich
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Thank you! Anyway could you quantify the number of trades you took in the over the year?

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Hey Peter, that's a very hard question to answer. I think most traders will remember easily how long it took them to turn their trading around and start seeing improvements over the numbers of actual trades. It can also be deceiving number because usually the worse you are doing the more trades you are taking and over trading. So it might not give you a good picture person by person. 

Here is my personal case:

January 2018 to June 2018:  Hard months of trading (shock effect: this ain't easy, bad habits of averaging down, taking too big of a risk, just not experienced enough in live trading.)

August 2018 to December 2018: - Drastic improvement in consistency. (More experienced,  taking better quality set ups, proper sizing and risk management, accepting red days)

January 2019: Still learning, I do not yet consider myself a profitable trader, I personally believe to reach that status you need to have at least 2 to 3 years consistently being profitable. So there is still a lot of work to do this year and the coming year. This is a marathon. 

Kurt posted some amazing feedback and advice!

Looking forward to what other members think. 

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Peter, for what it is worth, I have 17,107 tickets since February of last year when I decided I needed to focus on education instead of money.  All of these tickets are AFTER I completed my SIM three month period. Take that as you will.

Edited by KurtLoeblich

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that is exactly my point. I wanna know if the knowledge comes with days or number of orders 🙂

Anyway looking at Carlos answer i must say that i struggle quite a lot but actually i never did averaging down. I do not know why, my brain just does not take it. While it allows me to take too much risk. I remember when i was starting i had always a red day, then i somehow got immune to the fact that it is actual money and i felt a great release and immproved really for few weeks. Then fell into the too much risk accepted circle so i hope i get out.

Anyway the topic remains, it would be curious to see how much trades it took to each of you as the common practice seem so be to practice for some months but it seems to me waste of time to close the SIM after 3 bad trades especially in the very beginning when you need to practice the technical matters of trading and get used to the shortcuts etc. So maybe somebody was trading 10 trades for 3 months and someone took 5 trades for 6 months which would be the same number while every day is different for each person.

 

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Peter,

I don't think that's how it works. If you're consistently having days that put you at max loss (SIM or otherwise) then your issue is that you're either:

A) making bad trades and need to go back to the education stage and relearn what proper trades/strategy look like

Or

B)Your position size is too large and you're stopping yourself out before you give you trade time to develop.

People like Andrew with elevated trading experience have what I like to call "market intuition" which means they can sense what the market is about to do. It's not right 100 percent of the time, but it gives them the ability to know within a few cents or a few minutes if something is working or not. 

Have you ever looked at a chart and thought to yourself "oh, this is going to pop" or "this is going to tank" and then it happens pretty swiftly after you have that thought?  That's what people like Andrew have -- the difference between us and them is that they have far more knowledge on setups, psychology, and overall experience so they can get that feeling off of so many different signals that we just dont have tuned yet. Dont worry, with time and practice, you'll get there. 

That being said, and back to the original point, you need to figure out if your problem is option A or B. Both of them are pretty straightforward to fix and I'm happy to help you once you figure out which it is. 

 

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As i look at my journal from this year (i want to forget last year) i seem to be the B option currently (at least seems to be most obvious to me) so this should be easy to fix.

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Do you screenshot your trades?  If so, I'd love to take a look at them. If not, we can start working together this week and go over them after the fact. If it truly is just a position sizing issue, we can get that fixed in no time!  I'll just want to confirm thats the case by looking at 20 or so trades you've taken (winners AND losers).

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After 3 loosing days in the sim I realized my trades were way too big and risk/reward ratios nonexistent. When I cut way back on share size and got out of bad trades quickly I made $1000 on 6 trades. The nice thing I noticed is if the trade went bad I did not loose hundreds or thousands just 10 or 20 bucks. It also was not as stress full watching that Neg # climb. My goal now is to never loose more than $100 day hence the 60% looser and still profitable principle.

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